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Old 12-26-2011, 03:41 PM   #21
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I just had another idea come to mind which would fill the bill of a small round to hunt small game but with enough to take on bigger things. I have seen too much 22 ammo go bad over the years to want to depend on it going bang in a long term situation.

Had a looksee the other evening at a 300 Whisper which seems like a neat little round as it is a subsonic for the AR family but dies are a mint. It would have to be a custom rig but a 6.5MM TCU would be a nice round as it flies better and retains energy longer.

Loaded in a rifle with a 26" barrel it could be loaded low and slow with a 85, 100, 120 140 and 142 gr. bullets. The 85 gr can hit the 2700 fps range on the high end. the 120 gr. 2200 fps and the 140/142 gr. about 2100 fps as I too am a fan of Ed Harris cat sneeze work.

I have been playing with the Sierra ballistics program. With a 140 gr. bullet loaded at 1100 fps and sighted in at 150 yards it would give point blank accuracy to 175 yards and still be flying at 1024 fps at 175 yards. Being subsonic would be about the same sound level as a Nylon 66 shooting a 22LR.

6.5 Dies can be had without paying exorbitant prices and reamers and a GO Gage could be had for about 130.00.

This round is good on rams in metallic handgun silhouette matches with energy concentrated in a small area still delivers 315 lbs of energy in a quiet form at 175 yards or a 357 magnum 160 gr. launched at 1050 fps getting a hit at only 75 yards.

A 223 magazine could be extended to take the long 6.5 TCU bullet and most likely feed just fine.
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Old 12-27-2011, 07:30 AM   #22
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I've had 300 Whisper in both Contender and AR platforms for some time and really like it, but the latest issue of Hodgdon's Annual Manual[ has a piece about the 300 AAC Knockout which appears to be nothing more than attempt to avoid trademark issues.

I have done a lot of work with Trail Boss in centerfire rifles up to 300 RUM and it is wonderful stuff. You can get around 50% of the velocity of factory loads with little or no recoil and not much noise. I was playing with a 300WSM last week and a 168 Sierra at 1700-1800 fps. was 100% on a 10" steel at 300 yd.

I have no love at all for the combo guns although if it was for pure survival and the primary game would be some species of fowl it might work.

But if E&E was the primary concern I'm with Walt and want a suppressed .22. I have a 10-22 with an integral suppressed barrel that is quiet as a mouse and watertight ammo storage isn't much of a problem. Then you could zap an indian and take his food...

I'm not sure if there is a one size fits all solution but natural disaster is more likely than invasion so I believe my first thought would be for defending me and mine from those wanting my stuff.
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Old 12-27-2011, 08:41 AM   #23
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I chose a Ruger 10/26 for this purpose. Small enough for anyone to use, accurate enough to ge small game. Fast shooting for an emergency.
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Old 05-19-2013, 06:51 PM   #24
Join Date: May 2013
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need more info. where will you be? if it's the lower 48 states, I'd stick with my EDC pocket 9mm. You wont have time/resources to be cooking raw meat, gathering/butchering it, etc. You can push quite hard, physically, for a week without any food at all. If time or distance is an issue, you gotta carry rations. If you are lying around, you can last for a month. Many have fasted that long, like Ghandi did, without ill effects.

For dog packs, rabid animals, single shots and 22's are not enough, and the far more common, and far more dangerous attacker, men, you need more and swifter firepower. When you are wearing a backpack, it's quite hard to arrange for swift concealed access. the front pants pocket rig that I use for EDC works great, tho.

It's probably not going to be hunting season, at least, not for most game, right? So exactly what could you shoot with the .22 rifle, anyway, legally? Keltec's 9mm is 13 ozs. Smith used to offer a sweet little 2214, a 6" long, 18 oz auto that groups 2" at 25 yds, with nice sights and trigger pull. the safey's awkward to use, but on a small game gun, that doesn't matter. 18 ozs plus 13 ozs is just 2 lbs, with lots more versatility than any one gun can offer. There is a way to suppress the 2214, without making it more than 3" longer or 4 ozs heavier,

However, if you are thinking in terms of being a spook, I'd likely go with an integrally suppressed Browning Buckmark. The safety is more ergonomic and it's much easier to swap out the barrels on the Buck than on the Ruger. The gun's OAL, including the "can" may be held to just 9", rendering it concealable and still reasonably fast to access, IWB under a shirttail. With the slide locked forward, for manual manipulation, it's BB gun quiet. If you let the slide cycle normally, it sounds about as loud as a soft handclap.

With a backpack, tho, large pistols have to be concealed in a fannypack, worn in front. Such a Browning .22 will still group 2" at 25 yds, too. The 3" long barrel is deduced in OD to 3/8" and some of the can's baffling is telescoped back around the barrel. Velocity will run about 900 fps, at best, with 40 gr WW super x solids, If you want a bit more velocity, you can perhaps go with one of the "stinger' type hypervelocity loads, without getting sonic crack. I dumno about that part. Barrels and loads vary in their velocities. The 60 gr Aquila .22lr load might give you a bit more ooph with such a setup. Or you could have the OAL a bit longer.

If you are injured, or sick, a few snares and trotlines are far more likely to feed you than is any gun. At night, there is almost no place left in the lower 48 states that you can't climb a tree or hill and not see lights. Mark the direction and in daylight, move that way. It won't be more than 30 miles, 3days at most. You wont starve in 3 days. If you can't move well, what help is a 22 rifle, hmm? Build a smoky fire and keep it burning, somebody will come to check it out and will find you.

Smart people take satellite phones wth them on hikes into rough country these days. They also tell other people where they are going and when to expect contact, so as to start a search if they don't show up. So it's normally a lot more relevant to have a powerful centerfire in your front pants pocket holster than to have an AR7 slung with your pack. The "packing rifle" would have no other real use. The slim little 9mm, however, can be daily life insurance, no matter where you are.

If you are going to lug around a rifle, why not an AR in 223, with a .22lr conversion unit, and a "can" for the 223. That will suppress the .22 just fine, you know, using the 60 gr Aquila ammo, which is 950 fps in a rifle barrel. .30 cal ammo is heavy, bulky, and way overpowered for what you normally need. Once people start screaming and shouting the "sonic crack" of full power 223 softpoints, fired thru a canned rifle, will make no difference. There's a 100 gr subsonic 223 load, if you want a bit more power and penetration than the 22lr offers, now and then. Like for braining a cow or a sentry or guard dog, at 50 yds or so. The 300 rifles are extremely expensive. That is also true of the 223 right now, but the "normal" sort of guns and ammo are a lot more likely to come way down in price pretty soon.

Last edited by whatsit; 05-19-2013 at 07:13 PM.
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