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Old 12-26-2019, 06:39 PM   #1
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Virginia Liberty

This guy is selling mugs with 20 % of the proceeds going to fight Gubner Coonman's gun grab here in Virginia.

I know all of us need yet -another- coffee mug, let alone a 20 dollar one but if you feel so inclined, here's a link.

I'm in for a couple.
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Old 12-26-2019, 06:50 PM   #2
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Walt Graham,

I'll send the CASH to VP&RA instead. - Better than buying another OVERPRICED coffee cup. = That "deal" sounds like a MONEY-MAKING SCHEME to me.
(I used to sell "imprinted" coffee mugs as a sideline & they usually are marked up at least 500% of actual cost.)

yours, sw
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Old 12-26-2019, 06:52 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughboy View Post
Walt Graham,

I'll send the CASH to VP&RA instead. - Better than buying another OVERPRICED coffee cup. = That "deal" sounds like a MONEY-MAKING SCHEME to me.
(I used to sell "imprinted" coffee mugs as a sideline & they usually are marked up at least 500% of actual cost.)

yours, sw
Nope, I know this guy and I know what his overhead is or I wouldn't have linked it.

He's a vet.
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Old 12-27-2019, 04:52 PM   #4
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Doughboy - I'm the guy running the site.

No, I'm not marked up 500%..
I'm paying about 13 dollars per 11 oz mug because I can wholesale due to my business license. Of the 20 for the 11 oz mug, 4 of that goes to VCDL. That leaves me 3 dollars to keep my domain registry and the sitorefront running.

I just dontated $100 to vcdl, on ~500 dollars worth of sales (just a hair less than). I'm true to my word, 20% is going to vcdl. I have, after expenses (which include having the mugs dye sublimated and shipped, paying credit card fees per transaction and paypal fees when they apply) is about 30 dollars out of that 500. That covers my 1 month store front for next month. While I'm making a slight profit.. you can see I'm not doing a money making scheme. VCDL sees more from this than I do.

Even when I AM pressing my own mugs.. (and yes, I do press my own for custom orders) I can't do it for less than about 10 per mug my costs without any profit... and that is before shipping costs. We didn't even have any stainless tumblers before this group I'm using. Much to my surprise, their tumblers are actually solid quality. In this case, outsourcing was cheaper and allows me to donate more to vcdl. If they're that over priced.. I'd LOVE to find a source to do it cheaper and drop the prices while maintaining the same level of quality.. Dye sublimation isn't cheap printing.. its embedding and chemically bonding the dye (not ink, yes.. there is a subtle difference) to the surface of the mug/tumbler. These dont wear off in dishwashers and the like .. where cheap mugs fade and flake off.

Now, I do make a little more off the tumblers, but I also donate $5 dollars of the 10 I make off those.. so vcdl still sees more than I do off them. With those being the least ordered option.. I'm not rolling in the profits from those either.

Even if I choose the cheapest store out there and order at 72+ quantities.. I'm looking at 7.60 per mug before I ship it out.. shipping on a mug is between 4-5 dollars per mug.. putting it as 11.6 - 12.6.. and adds in a week + delay in delivery. The extra 40 cents for the faster delivery is well worth it to me. At the rate I'm selling at, I would be sitting here with a dozen or so mugs on the shelf after all is said and done.. and as you know as someone who once sold.. inventory is a loss. While I'm not operating at 100% profits given to vcdl.. I'm at 50+% .. which every other fund raiser I've seen hasn't touched. The other one that got close.. was the PSA lowers.. where you paid 75 and they donated $10 You buy 60 here (two travel mugs) and I donate $10, 3 coffee mugs.. and I end up donating $12.

Last edited by scythefwd; 12-27-2019 at 06:11 PM.
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Old 12-27-2019, 07:13 PM   #5
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What he said - and he's a friend of mine.

Do as you like.

We all hang together or we hang alone...
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Old 12-28-2019, 06:31 AM   #6
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scytefwd; WaltGraham,

SORRY. I had no idea that your operation was that small. = When I was selling "advertising specialties", my minimum order for delivery to a retail client on "imprinted mugs" was ONE GROSS & often 2-5 gross.
(I once delivered an initial order of the firm's trade-style on "gold on gloss black" 2500 pieces to a large law firm & about a year later the firm made another similar sized order.)

For such a small order at wholesale, I'm NOT surprised what high prices that you are paying per piece.

Note: "Giveaway coffee mugs" in return for political & other fund-raising "donations" often are procured in HUNDREDS of GROSS or more per delivery to the organization. - For example, for the RNC, RNSC, DNC or DNCC.
(At "giveaways" of that size the S&H generally costs the organization MORE than the mugs or other merchandise's wholesale price per piece.)

yours, sw
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Old 12-28-2019, 07:03 AM   #7
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No prob, you had everyone's best interests in mind; we might even get a new member out of the deal...
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Old 12-28-2019, 09:10 AM   #8
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No worries. I don't expect to see a gross sold total out of this. I might become a hundredaire lol. I appreciate the call out. Keeps things honest. I stood this up just to generate a few dollars towards the cause.

Printing vs dye sublimation is two different beasts. Are you familiar with the dye sub process?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughboy View Post
scytefwd; WaltGraham,

SORRY. I had no idea that your operation was that small. = When I was selling "advertising specialties", my minimum order for delivery to a retail client on "imprinted mugs" was ONE GROSS & often 2-5 gross.
(I once delivered an initial order of the firm's trade-style on "gold on gloss black" 2500 pieces to a large law firm & about a year later the firm made another similar sized order.)

For such a small order at wholesale, I'm NOT surprised what high prices that you are paying per piece.

Note: "Giveaway coffee mugs" in return for political & other fund-raising "donations" often are procured in HUNDREDS of GROSS or more per delivery to the organization. - For example, for the RNC, RNSC, DNC or DNCC.
(At "giveaways" of that size the S&H generally costs the organization MORE than the mugs or other merchandise's wholesale price per piece.)

yours, sw
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Old 12-28-2019, 11:26 AM   #9
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scythefwd,

GOOD ON YOU.

Nope, I know ZILCH about dye sublimation, as I dealt exclusively in "hard goods", like coffee mugs, ashtrays, letter openers, pocket knives, beer steins (That is a GREAT marketing deal, as people NEVER throw away imprinted beer steins & often put them "on display" & show their collection off to others.), etc.

ALL that I did was show samples to clients, write up orders, design the artwork (IF the client didn't already have their own "proofs"), send the orders to the maker's OCONUS factory & patiently await my "cut" of each sale.
(The easiest sale that I ever made was the law firm that I mentioned earlier. = I showed a sample to the Senior Partner, he handed me a piece of stationary with their trade-style & asked, "Can you put that on a coffee mug?"= I said, "YES, Sir", asked him how many pieces that he wanted to start with & wrote up the order- The re-order was even easier: I got a fax that said, "Do the same order again ASAP.- We like your mugs.")

.yours, sw

Last edited by Doughboy; 12-28-2019 at 12:09 PM. Reason: addenda
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Old 12-28-2019, 11:52 AM   #10
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dye sublimation is hard to automate..

Where a lot of promotional mugs and stuff (except steins, which are now laser etched.. and I have a source for those too lol.. but figured guns and booze dont mix) are screen printed or printed on.. dye sub is a different application process.

You end up taking a specially coated transfer paper using a special dye and printing the object backwards (mirror imaged). Then you tape it to the surface you're trying to imprint. Then you heat the living hell out of it. Take it up to about 4oo degrees, and the die goes from liquid to gas state. This is why you taped it to the object you're dying.. It traps the gas against the substrate (usually a polymer coating thats microns thin and transparent).. and as it cools back down, the die sublimates from gas to solid.. embedded in the substrate. Its very literally chemically bonded to the substrate at this point. Heat below temps needed to evaporate the dye (so keep it under 400 degrees please.. I know its hard). It wont wash off, it doesnt fade. I have mugs I use daily and wash daily that are as bright as the day I made them.

Now the gear is $$ to get started. Some folks use silicon wraps and a toaster oven set at max to heat the mugs.. that takes 30 minutes per load, and you only get 2-6 mugs done per load.. and then you have to wait for it to cool back down. The faster, and unfortunately more $$ method is a dedicated mug press with flexible heaters. They wrap around the mug (different profiles per mug size, shape.. more $$ to tool up) and heat the mug in about 2 minutes.. then shut off automatically. You still have to handle with hot mitts, BUT you can do 2 (largest auto press I've seen was 6 at a time.. and its BIG $$.. my 2 mug press ran a couple bills on the used market) in a matter of 4 minutes. You still have to print, cut the transfer paper, tape on, and then heat though.. so it's a time consuming process. For a small home place like me.. if anyone ever prints with the wrong ink, my 300 dollar printer is now useless.. well its good for printer on paper, but I have to remove all the ink and print head and hope no real damage was done to the printer.

I could have went with the lower, less durable product and went for profit.. but I wanted to at least offer the best product I could for the price point. These should last years with no fade or chipping of the images.. Something that will last.

As an example of the durability. This is one of the 20 oz tumblers I used as a test print. If you look in the image at the link I'm posting.. you'll see some small scratches in the surface. I put those there with a green scratchy pad (on the back of a sponge )and a little bit of elbow grease. More than I'd use washing the external of a cup usually.. I was intentionally trying to scratch the image. That was a good 10-20 seconds of my scrubbing.. As you can see.. the image itself is undamaged. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1OM5...ew?usp=sharing <-my scratched tumbler. The scratches are hard to capture because any time I'm directly on them.. the glare gets in the way. Look to the left side of the image and come in towards the center.. you'll see vertical scratches across the dyed image.

Last edited by scythefwd; 12-28-2019 at 12:12 PM.
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Old 12-28-2019, 12:13 PM   #11
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scythefwd,

SOUNDS FINE - GOOD LUCK.

I never got into MAKING anything. - All the goods that I sold came out of a large Asian factory.
(Mostly Thailand & ROC.)

You should join our group.

yours, sw

Last edited by Doughboy; 12-28-2019 at 12:15 PM. Reason: typo
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Old 12-28-2019, 12:19 PM   #12
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We do hope to get to doing something like that some day.. maybe not in the grosses.. but orders of a few dozen for small local shops every couple years.. and maintenance "prints".. some of what I'm doing now is testing some of that outsourcing of production you talked about.. It was a good time to try it, and since the other side of the business is trying to stay as apolitical .. I stood up the virginialiberty site strictly to keep it all separate (which makes it a perfect test case as well)

As to joining the group.. i'm here.. I'm not likely an avid poster.. but I'll contribute where I can.
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