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Old 04-28-2015, 06:04 AM   #1
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CCW Intervenes...Would You?

Interesting story. I think the man acted correctly, although it certainly could have ended badly for either side.

VIDEO: Kroger Customer Draws Gun, Intervenes To Protect Elderly Man - Breitbart
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Old 04-28-2015, 07:25 AM   #2
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Apparently this was a domestic situation... he may have very well had all 7 of the attackers and the victim testifying against him.

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Old 04-28-2015, 07:52 AM   #3
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The elderly man was being attacked by his nephew, and refused to press charges ....
I hope that doesn't come back to haunt him.
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Old 04-28-2015, 08:11 AM   #4
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From the "article" (really, that's journalism? Almost nothing about what actually happened, just some guy pulled a gun), it's impossible to tell the extent of the attack other than the elderly man was bloodied. I can't say I would or wouldn't have intervened, just not enough information to go on in that "report").
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Old 04-28-2015, 10:21 AM   #5
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From the "article" (really, that's journalism? Almost nothing about what actually happened, just some guy pulled a gun), it's impossible to tell the extent of the attack other than the elderly man was bloodied. I can't say I would or wouldn't have intervened, just not enough information to go on in that "report").
I agree that the reporting is slim at best. And I must admit I was looking at it in "what would I do" way, which I shouldn't. I would act because I am bound to act, wheelchair, cane or no. I am still an active, employed LEO. I would more likely present a badge than my gun...at least at first, and would have already hit 911 on my cell.

I think, from what info the "article" and video provide, the guy did okay.

But what if those seven people had rushed him? Coulda been nasty.

Speaking of which, anyone seen this?

Video: Cop shot, 7 other cops hurt in deadly Ariz. melee
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Old 04-28-2015, 10:34 AM   #6
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But what if those seven people had rushed him?
Well, it would be noisy and bloody...

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Old 04-28-2015, 10:39 AM   #7
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Old 04-28-2015, 11:05 AM   #8
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Obviously "get down" isn't effective. Where was the cavalry? Every cop within miles should have lit up.

For the original situation don't think the citizen was unreasonable.
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Old 04-28-2015, 12:28 PM   #9
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Hard to call that one unless you're actually on site.
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Old 04-28-2015, 01:56 PM   #10
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Obviously "get down" isn't effective. Where was the cavalry? Every cop within miles should have lit up.

For the original situation don't think the citizen was unreasonable.
Charlie, from what I've been able to learn, this is a fairly small town. I think most if not all of their on-duty folks were on the scene. I understand they called for back up from the Sheriff's Office, but it was late in the game, and like our guys, out in the unincorporated parts of the county, so response time sucked.

I'd like to hear tapes of their dispatch center...see if they checked on these guys, and when they (dispatch) sounded the alarm...or a supervisor did.

One heckuva melee, though. And there comes a time, when the odds are that bad and they are grabbing for your gun, that Tazer's and OC go out the window and it's time stop the fight. The hell with political correctness.

I'm glad only the bad guy was killed.
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Old 04-28-2015, 01:59 PM   #11
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Well, it would be noisy and bloody...
Yeah. But he would have to be ready to pull the trigger. And some people aren't.
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Old 04-28-2015, 05:52 PM   #12
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I've gotta give kudos to the guys who didn't clock the clown who kept repeating "You're hitting children".

I am curious as to what the dispatcher may have said during the call out. I really didn't see anything in the limited dash cam footage to spark the rather aggessive initial response.
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Old 04-28-2015, 08:58 PM   #13
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Point taken Terry... I'm a city boy.

It also looks like things didn't go to pot until the cop got there but I didn't see anything to blame him for either....

there was a black hearted saying that makes sense to me in light of current events: send in bullets and beer and book the winner...

I know there was a corollary... build a 20 foot fence and then...

I must also confess that in my 27 years that never happened and I know it is not politically correct but what justice does it bring to the guy the cops allegedly (PC here) killed to loot the CVS?
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Old 04-29-2015, 05:48 AM   #14
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what justice does it bring to the guy the cops allegedly (PC here) killed to loot the CVS?
It isn't about justice...

So, what is it about?

This.
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Old 04-29-2015, 09:29 AM   #15
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The sad part is, because of the rioting an looting, the whole issue of a man who died under very questionable circumstances is lost. This one isn't like Ferguson, which was just BS. This one has legitimate questions. The smart thing would be to see if the investigators are going to answer those questions, rather than riot. Peaceful demonstrations to say, we're not going to let you cover it up like they did in New York; we're not going to tolerate that.

There's lots of reasons for the rioting; some legitimate, some just opportunistic. I'm more worried that what happened in New York will happen in Baltimore, and that just fuels the fire.

Had any one of us taken that man in New York by force, and then he stopped breathing AFTER telling us he couldn't breathe...and then was pulse-less for 7 full minutes before anyone did anything. If that was anyone of us, we'd be sitting in jail for negligent homicide; that you can bet your life on.

But since they were cops, the DA conveniently takes them before a grand jury on murder charges, knowing full well that's the wrong charge, and anyone who saw that video would know there was no murder intent by anyone...so they knew they wouldn't get an indictment.

The fear is, due process will not happen. After New York, I'd say there is some legitimacy to that fear.

Now I'm not saying this justifies the rioting and looting; that's unjustifiable. But it sure the hell justifies people being upset...I'm one of them.
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Old 04-30-2015, 03:49 PM   #16
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I can't honestly say what I'd do--the only real predictable scenario for me every day is that if someone assaults the driver of a bus I'm on, then I will engage because when you operate a motor vehicle, everyone aboard with you shares your fate.

Other than that, I'd really have to be in the situation to call the play, but as a general rule I'd be more "call 911, take notes, be best witness possible, have sidearm ready in case fight insists on coming to me/mine."
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