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Old 05-08-2015, 07:18 AM   #61
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"Yes, I was a party member, but I didn't have anything to do with the atrocities. We heard the rhetoric, but we thought it was just that: talk. We saw our Jewish neighbors taken away, but we thought they were merely being relocated. We saw the Gypsies disappear, but they were kind of shiftless anyway. We heard that we were the Master Race, destined to rule the world, but didn't give it much more thought. Besides, what could I do? If I had protested, I would have disappeared too".


! A =/= B
That which is red is revealed the lie by that which is green.

Nevertheless I'm not sure how fast that analogy holds. I'd equate the militant Islamists, or "Jihadis" with the WaffenSS, Einsatzgruppen, or other Nazi "truebelievers" and the average German Citizen with the average Muslim citizen/believer. Even that comparison, however, is not outside criticism. When General Patton took over Bavaria in the months after hostilities ceased, he caused a big commotion when he refused to remove many purported "nazis" from lower offices, arguing, I think correctly, that many were forced by circumstances to be a nazi party member and that if he just arbitrarily removed all nazis the whole structure of the society would collapse.
But Patton was not talking about the SS or, as I said, other "true believers." Those SS and their ilk were dangerous and I can't see there being any "good" ones.
There are certainly good Muslims and we need their help. A lot.

Last edited by TommyGunn; 05-08-2015 at 07:21 AM.
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Old 05-08-2015, 07:31 AM   #62
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CaptainGyro,

EXACTLY.

yours, sw
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Old 05-08-2015, 07:44 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by CaptainGyro View Post
One group:
Believes anyone who doesn't believe in their God deserves to die.
Incinerates people in office buildings.
Recruits children to carry suicide bombs.
Kidnaps, rapes, and sells young girls.
Kidnaps, rapes, and forces young boys to fight for them.
Buries people up to their necks and bashes their brains out with stones.
Beheads hostages slowly and cruelly, then distributes the videos.
Engages in slavery.

Another group:
Draws cartoons.

Name the hate group.
Appropriated that to share on my favorite comment board.
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Old 05-08-2015, 08:18 AM   #64
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I haven't really read my copy of the Koran/Quran in depth, but it's questionable that the ban on images of the Prophet are in it. Like other middle eastern religions, there's Holy Writ and then there's the body of law and sayings (of the prophet) related to and interpreting Holy Writ. I'd rather expect the image ban is in the other stuff.

Comparisons of Islam to National Socialism are problematical. One was a political system and the other is a religion-which, if you believe the Saudis (and some others)-also serves as the template for government. Most of us don't recognize the appalling social conditions of 1918-1932 Germany. [For a clue check out Len Deighton's Winter. I got to know folks who lived through it.] I hope and pray we don't get direct experience.

Grouping the Waffen SS with the actual SS is also problematical. There were some Waffen SS units that were as fanatical as the SS. There were also many who were simply highly motivated and trained soldiers, not all of whom were German. Some of all nationalities joined up for various reasons, including regular meals-or what passed for regular back then. The Nord Division was felt to be so highly ethical that they were chosen as one of the role models for the Bundeswehr.

AAANNNND, we're drifting big time.
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Old 05-08-2015, 11:22 AM   #65
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Comparisons of Islam to National Socialism are problematical. One was a political system and the other is a religion-which, if you believe the Saudis (and some others)-also serves as the template for government.
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Old 05-08-2015, 11:58 AM   #66
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Of interest re the Texas incident.

Here.
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Old 05-08-2015, 12:37 PM   #67
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When General Patton took over Bavaria in the months after hostilities ceased, he caused a big commotion when he refused to remove many purported "nazis" from lower offices, arguing, I think correctly, that many were forced by circumstances to be a nazi party member and that if he just arbitrarily removed all nazis the whole structure of the society would collapse.
But Patton was not talking about the SS or, as I said, other "true believers." Those SS and their ilk were dangerous and I can't see there being any "good" ones.
There are certainly good Muslims and we need their help. A lot.
Excellent point--my great-uncle worked for Patton, and his particular unit was tasked with a special method of handling True Believers even behind enemy lines and while the fighting was still raging: they were three days ahead of the line, tasked with hunting down and destroying those SS bastards before they could give any more of Germany the Scorched Earth treatment. Do remember, at the end the SS's obiter dictum was to destroy everyone and everything... so anybody who wants to accuse Patton of being soft on Nazis--man, if Uncle Frank were still with us he'd have some choice words for 'em since he was living proof to the contrary; when his unit took the camp at Gunskirchen HQ had to pull them back within 24 hours so they'd have some SS left ALIVE to stand trial at Nuremberg.
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Old 05-08-2015, 12:37 PM   #68
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Kevin Gibson,

IF a terrorist is "caught in the act" OCONUS but NOT killed during his/her capture, we should try them at a military tribunal (just as the NAZI war criminals were) by "the host nation" and HANGED within 3 days, preferably near where they were involved in terrorist actions. = There are WAR CRIMINALS & nothing short of hanging or firing squad is appropriate, imVho.

ImVho, IF a murderer/rapist/child molester is apprehended while engaged in the act, it is FOOLISH to claim that they might be innocent.

yours, sw
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Old 05-08-2015, 03:44 PM   #69
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Excellent point--my great-uncle worked for Patton.
My father in law ran an infantry company for him - loved the man...
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Old 05-08-2015, 07:04 PM   #70
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There were some muslims in the SS also.
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Old 05-09-2015, 07:47 AM   #71
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There were some muslims in the SS also.
That's a pretty interesting story. Stalin was never very kind to any religious group, and the Muslims in the southern socialist republics experienced some particularly brutal treatment. When the Soviet armies in those republics were overrun by the Nazis, the German POW camps were full of Muslim prisoners. The Germans offered them a choice: stay in prison and starve to death, or put on a Waffen SS uniform and help us fight Uncle Joe. It was a pretty easy choice.

Later, as the German armies got pushed back to the Fatherland, the muslim troops went with them, providing much of the basis for the large muslim populations in cities like Munich today.
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Old 05-10-2015, 04:57 PM   #72
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My father in law ran an infantry company for him - loved the man...
Uncle Frank didn't *like* GSP, but he did *respect* him--which was a hell of a lot better than how he viewed Bootlicker Bradley and many other officers in the ETO.
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Old 06-08-2015, 04:02 PM   #73
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Having seen "most" if not having seen it ALL....

I still have a hard time wrapping my head around the fact that there are states without SHALL ISSUE CCW, or plain old Constitutional Carry like we have here in AZ.

It just seems SO fundamental to me, that to question it is befuddling.

Other officers I have worked with over the years express the same sentiments.
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Old 06-08-2015, 05:22 PM   #74
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bearcat6,

Indeed there were Muslims in the SS. = TWO whole brigades of those murdering swine.

yours, sw
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Old 06-08-2015, 06:49 PM   #75
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Frisco, Texas is working at the problem. Come January 1 2016 we'll have licensed open and concealed carry plus campus carry. Then in 2 years when the legislature is in session again we'll work on Constitutional carry.
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Old 06-09-2015, 07:46 AM   #76
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Frisco, Texas is working at the problem. Come January 1 2016 we'll have licensed open and concealed carry plus campus carry. Then in 2 years when the legislature is in session again we'll work on Constitutional carry.
Amen to that...now if Nevada would just do their best to catch up.
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Old 06-09-2015, 09:10 AM   #77
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Frisco, Texas is working at the problem. Come January 1 2016 we'll have licensed open and concealed carry plus campus carry. Then in 2 years when the legislature is in session again we'll work on Constitutional carry.
Well....I hope you darned Texas brush poppers (couldn't resist the jab) get it.
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Old 06-09-2015, 09:17 AM   #78
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But of course...."blood will run in the streets".

Isn't that the tired old rallying cry of the left?

Funny thing...when I started on the job in 89...the was no CCW in AZ so only us cops could carry concealed, but open carry was so commonplace that the guy who ran the Burger King on Grant Road near Country Club carried a Blackhawk on his hip. YES....it was his property, so he could have carried it concealed, but he was a bit eccentric, and loved his "thumb buster".

Move forward a few years, and Arizona FINALLY got CCW for civilians, and the some of the transplants to our great state screamed that "blood will run in the streets"......and it didn't happen. No one with any common sense really expected it to.

Now, we have Constitutional Carry (Thank you Governor Brewer...we still miss you). Though I still recommend getting a CCW so you can carry in 41 other states...you don't NEED a piece of paper to exercise a right here in AZ.

AND....blood STILL isn't running in the streets.

Yes, I can carry nation-wide under LEOSA....that's great for me...but it sucks for other folks who can't. I HOPE that nation-wide reciprocity becomes a reality soon too.

OFF my soapbox now.
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Old 06-09-2015, 09:28 AM   #79
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Frisco, et. al.,

The leftists are divided (imVho) into two groups:

1. the leftist LIARS, who are "progressive leaders"
and
2. The ignorant/na´ve/STUPID people, who still believe "the leadership" about SILLY foolishness like "blood will run in the streets" and/or accept ANYTHING that the "mainstream press" and "the elites" claim.

The OLDER that I get, the LESS patience that I have with either/both groups.

yours, sw
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Old 06-09-2015, 02:03 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by stand watie View Post
Frisco, et. al.,

The leftists are divided (imVho) into two groups:

1. the leftist LIARS, who are "progressive leaders"
and
2. The ignorant/na´ve/STUPID people, who still believe "the leadership" about SILLY foolishness like "blood will run in the streets" and/or accept ANYTHING that the "mainstream press" and "the elites" claim.

The OLDER that I get, the LESS patience that I have with either/both groups.

yours, sw
2(a). The willful idiots who believe the 'common sense gun safety' bullwash...which gets us THIS:
NJ Woman stabbed to death by ex while waiting months for gun permit
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