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Old 08-16-2015, 02:31 PM   #1
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1909 Argentine Mauser

I saw this Mauser the other in a local GS and the price tag was $1700 it was the beast Mauser I have seen in person.The rifle was all matching of course wood was perfect and I mean perfect with all the car touches in place.The old man I think is finally going out of business for his shop is getting thin (all the Johnson rifles are gone) but the point is he dropped the price to $1100.I did not know anything about that particular rifle and did a search and most run about $500-800 usually but the condition nothing like this one.The one I found was in even better condition stock wise than this one http://www.gunsinternational.com/gun...n_id=100589634 and a blondee stock to boot and the rifle had the barrel cap.Alot of the stuff I try to buy is from a collector standpoint for value in the future but my emotions have been swung by this of late but it's "I want one again" http://garandguy.com/product/apennin...inch-barrel/.I feel the Mauser ATTM should be the purchase chime in and give me an opinion.Kevin
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Old 08-16-2015, 02:43 PM   #2
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If you want it and can afford it, get it. There are those who say our "money" isn't going to worth anything in the future anyway. (Actually, it's not worth anything now, but almost everyone still believes it is. We are operating on a completely faith-based economy and have been for decades.)
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Old 08-16-2015, 03:06 PM   #3
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I hear you about the money part Snake and agree but in saying that the BM59 clone would be the route to take.Then on the other hand if the SHTF scenario never plays out then the 1909 would hold it's value better down the road I think?But how collectible is a 1909?that's another question The old actual military stuff holds it's value and continues to move in positive ranges.More Google I guess.Keep the thoughts coming.
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Old 08-16-2015, 05:35 PM   #4
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Back in the early 1970's Natchez Shooters Supplies distributor had a small shipment of BRAND NEW 1909 Mauser's with the original test target.
Price was something like $130 and like a stupe I didn't buy one.

In the 1980's one of the Guns & Ammo Annuals did an article on "Why custom gunsmiths prefer the Mauser Rifle".
Part of it stated that the 1909 Argentine made by DWM was the finest quality military Mauser ever made.
The metal work and bluing is better INSIDE then most modern rifles are OUTSIDE.

Virtually ever part is numbered to the rifle, and parts like the rear sight and ejector box are heat blued.

It was the only military Mauser ever to have all the custom commercial Mauser features like the hinged floor plate with release inside the trigger guard, and the pear-shaped bolt handle.

The author said that to be able to reproduce the DWM 1909 to the same standards of fit and finish, the rifle would cost $3,000. And that was in mid-1980's dollars.

I had a really nice rifle later, and a 1909 cavalry carbine in lesser condition and again, stupidly let them go.

Bottom line, IF it's really in the condition you say, and you can afford it, it isn't going to lose value.
Also, if you will ever only own ONE Mauser rifle, this is THE one.

One indication of how much actual use it had is to check the bolt face. Due to the corrosive ammo used almost any shooting will leave a slight pitted ring around the firing pin hole.
It doesn't take much, but it is a gage of actual use.
Mine looked like it had barely been handled but did have a slight ring.

Last edited by dfariswheel; 08-16-2015 at 05:40 PM.
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Old 08-16-2015, 06:29 PM   #5
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I had started thinking the same in some regards as far as value goes dfariswheel.I found another online @1600.00 with were the stock was maybe an 80 if this one is a 100 the metal is beautiful.If I am right the cleaning rod and cap should be # to the rifle as well and both were present I will look Tuesday.The BM59 will be there a year from now Ralph's shop probably not.
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Old 08-16-2015, 07:44 PM   #6
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To ALL,

To me alone, the "neo plus ultra" in Mauser rifles is a REAL "Spanish Scorpion" 1893, that has "acceptable provenance" of wartime use in the SA War.
(I've seen TWO such rifles in 50+ years. - One is in an Austin collector's home, with a personal letter, signed by his GF's company commander allowing him to "bring it home" in 1899 & the other was at the NRA Museum & once belonged to an enlisted aide to BG Leonard Wood.)

I would also "grab with both hands" any firearm actually used at the Siege of Peiping, during the Boxer Rebellion.
(I wrote my first mini-thesis on the Siege of the Foreign Legations.)

yours, sw
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Old 08-18-2015, 10:00 AM   #7
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Well I picked up the Mauser today and I think will be a sound investment.

Argentine 7.65X53mm w/29.5" bbl.,blue/ bright finish,walnut stock.This an excellent example of a pre-war Mauser contract rifle manufactured for Argentina.These are marked on top of the receiver ring with the large Argentina Crest and the left side of the receiver is marked "MAUSER MODELO/ ARGENTINO 1909" and the receiver side wall is marked "DEUTSCHE WAFFEN UND/MUNTIONSFABRIKEN,BERLIN".The right side of the chamber is marked with the serial number and a proof mark.The tangent rear sight graduates to 2000 meters and the top of the slide has a small "anchor"proof which may indicate that it belonged to the Argentine Navy.It has a bright polished receiver,bolt and forend/bayonet lug with the remaining parts blue.Mounted with a full one piece nicely figured walnut pistol grip stock and handguard stamped with the matching serial number on the right side at the receiver ,oval proof on the right rear and a shield with "AG"in the center of the grip.Complete with a correct cleaning rod numbered to the rifle.Complete with a muzzle/front sight cover number to the rifle.All visible numbers match.

CONDITION:Excellent with 97% blue finish remaining on the barrel.There is an area behind the front barrel band that is thinning and there is some pin prick type pitting on the forward portion.The bayonet lug/forend has a smooth brown patina.The remaining blue finish parts retain 98% original finish with a few minor scratches on the floor plate.The receiver and bolt handle are beginning to turn gray in areas.The bore is clean/bright.The stock is excellent with a few minor dings/scratches.The markings are crisp and clear.The action is excellent.

From the auction slip.
Attached Images
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Last edited by Javlin; 08-18-2015 at 10:22 AM.
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Old 08-18-2015, 10:03 AM   #8
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Few more pics
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Last edited by Javlin; 08-18-2015 at 10:06 AM.
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Old 08-18-2015, 03:21 PM   #9
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Javlin,

It makes me SICK to think about how many 1909 Argentines, that were AS NEW & that I "cut-up" into sporters, when they were 25.oo each at Gibson's Discount Centers & the 10 buck Spanish Mausers that I "sporterized" too.

Back then, NOBODY thought ANY pre-war Mauser would ever be worth as much as a nicely sporterized one would sell for. = I sold NUMEROUS sporterized Argentines for 75-125.oo back then, as I was "pretty good" at cutting-down & refinishing rifles for hunting the deer woods, as 7mm & 7.65MM ammo was about a buck for 20 ball rounds.
(Cheapskates like me bought ball ammo, pulled the bullets & replaced them with JSP bullets.)

Of course, I can also remember when Lugars in good shape sold for 75-150 bucks too.

Note: Let me make everyone "sick". I bought a Winchester Model 42 Skeet-gun with ribbed barrel in GREAT shape for 35.oo & a used bicycle (that I bought a a garage sale for 5 bucks.).

yours, sw
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Old 08-18-2015, 03:51 PM   #10
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Of course, I can also remember when Lugars in good shape sold for 75-150 bucks too.

HA.
I remember $40 Luger's and $30 P-38's in like new.

A lot of the 1909 Mauser's had an added bayonet adapter pinned to the original bayonet latch so a newer bayonet could be used.
This was slipped over the original latch and pinned in place. It was in bright metal.

I don't think the anchor meant it was Navy issue, I seem to recall it was a standard mark on all of them.
There should be a logo-type stamp on the right side of the butt stock indicating what unit it was issued to.
I have no idea how to interpret the stamp to ID what the units were.
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Old 08-18-2015, 04:21 PM   #11
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dfariswheel,

I also remember 30.oo P-38 pistols too BUT I could not THEN or NOW shoot one of those !@#$%^! things well.

yours, sw
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Old 08-18-2015, 07:19 PM   #12
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In 1963 I went in a pawn shop in Kansas City, Kan. and they had aglass case with two shelves full of P-38s, your choice $35.00. Back then $35.00 was a little harder to come by.
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Old 08-18-2015, 08:00 PM   #13
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bearcat6,

YES, it was.

The deal that I didn't take that I surely wish NOW that I had taken, as I had some TDY cash "burning a hole in my jeans" at the time. = An entire case of NOS Model 10 S&W 2" revolvers that were bought in 1956, from an OK PD.
24 at 20.oo each, taking ALL or none.

yours, sw

Last edited by stand watie; 08-18-2015 at 08:02 PM. Reason: typo
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Old 08-19-2015, 05:31 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stand watie View Post
Javlin,

It makes me SICK to think about how many 1909 Argentines, that were AS NEW & that I "cut-up" into sporters, when they were 25.oo each at Gibson's Discount Centers & the 10 buck Spanish Mausers that I "sporterized" too.
yours, sw
I read that some where on the net that these guys were sought after for their accuracy and action.Seeing she stands taller than any other rifle in the collection 29.5" barrel when most are 20-22"...

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfariswheel View Post
I don't think the anchor meant it was Navy issue, I seem to recall it was a standard mark on all of them.
There should be a logo-type stamp on the right side of the butt stock indicating what unit it was issued to.
I have no idea how to interpret the stamp to ID what the units were.
There was only the one stamp.I now have #802 FN49 Argentine(Navy) matching and this from Argentina;and from Germany a 98 and the G43.

Now I have to start saving some more money.Kevin
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Old 08-20-2015, 10:37 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snake45 View Post
If you want it and can afford it, get it. There are those who say our "money" isn't going to worth anything in the future anyway. (Actually, it's not worth anything now, but almost everyone still believes it is. We are operating on a completely faith-based economy and have been for decades.)
Most don't realize that we're on a fiat currency after the gold standard failed for the 3rd time in under two decades. There are serious problems with the gold standard. There's a bunch of good reasons why pretty much no nation uses it anymore.

But you're correct that a fiat currency is based on the perception of value. It's the world's largest game of pretend.
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