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Time for Colt to make a comeback?

9K views 47 replies 17 participants last post by  M118LR 
#1 ·
Is it just me, but, with .45 Autos in very high demand, and guns moving all over the place, how is Colt not doing something big? I mean, ads, new 1911s, heck tacticalize a bit or re-release some classic models, do some fanfare?

It seems insane they aren't taking advantage of this period. Heck, they should be able to sell anything if they can get back to high prodution, as long as it is decent quality and goes bang.

Heck they also make AR-15s, I was wondering if they could get their AR-15s and AR-18s back into more of the consumer's eye with some kind of ad push? If they need to add production, maybe they could produce out of Japan with extra rifles? The Japanese could use business too so it would be win win for a joint venture.

Just brainstorming here. It seems a primo time for Colt to start making some noise again.
 
#5 ·
Colt is well on it's way in a major comeback.
In the early 2000's, the company was bought and was in bad shape after all the years of corporation mis-management.
When you're teetering on the sharp edge of bankruptcy, have antiquated machinery, and have lost most of your best production people, you can't just start making things like you'd want.

They've been slowly and carefully upgrading the equipment and not taking chances with loosing money with dumb moves.
Colt is selling everything they can produce, and production is ramping up.

According to Brent Turchi, Colt will make something just under THREE times the number of 1911 series pistols this year that they made last year.
The AR market is booming, and Colt is carefully introducing new models that they're sure are going to sell.
The company leadership has and is continuing to discuss introducing double action revolvers again, and it seems to be a matter of WHEN and WHAT.

All the bad decisions and bad business moves were done by the previous Colt ownership, NOT the current owners and managers.
Too many people are thinking Colt is still back in the 90's and have ignored that things have changed.

Just in the last year Colt has introduced several new models of the 1911 series, the Colt New Frontier, the New Agent, a new double action 1911 type auto, the Mustang .380, the new 1911 Rail Gun, and several new AR type rifles including the new LE901 .308 AR type rifle.
 
#6 ·
I agree that Colt is making a comeback, but also their history is a great case study in how not to run a company.

Last year I tested three new Colts: two pistols and a rifle and all were completely reliable. The only surprise was that the vaunted Gold Cup didn't shoot any better than a basic Kimber or Springfield.

It also looks like they are holding the line on prices although I guess we'll always pay a little more for the name.

In the recent past a writer couldn't get the time of day from them but now they're calling us and you can again see the name in gunzines.

I will be surprised if they go back to double-action revolvers because S&W and Ruger really have that market cornered. If they tried to resurrect a DA revolver the old design would probably cost a fortune to make. I'm fairly sure they could design something new and sell some based on the name alone but I wonder if the revolver market is big enough to support a new entry.
 
#8 ·
I will be surprised if they go back to double-action revolvers because S&W and Ruger really have that market cornered. If they tried to resurrect a DA revolver the old design would probably cost a fortune to make. I'm fairly sure they could design something new and sell some based on the name alone but I wonder if the revolver market is big enough to support a new entry.
If Colt wanted to, could they cost-effectively produce their later coil-spring DA revolvers (e.g., DS-VI, Magnum Carry, Boa, Anaconda, etc.)?

As I recall, an early criticism of the coil-spring models involved the use of sintered parts but the related MIM process seems to have been perfected, at least by whoever now does it for S&W.
 
#7 ·
Last year I checked out a Colt 1911 variant, the trigger pull was not great more like a DA S&W, a 1911 with a GREAT trigger pull was the Sig!
Geoff
Who finds that interesting, I wish I could pull triggers on all the pistols at the local Gun Shop with my gauge, but I have noticed inconsistency in the readings. I suspect I need practice.
 
#9 ·
I don't know who does S&W's MIM parts right now and suspect they have more than one vendor. I do know that the first rear adjustable sights on revolvers after they began to routinely drill and tap for scope bases were made by Remington.

There are several MIM companies both on and off shore that do work on a contract basis for whomever wants their services.

I don't understand why so many people think MIM parts are automatically bad. I've been to two MIM plants and am impressed with the process. If the sprue remnant is polished off a metallurgist would probably need a microscope to tell the difference.

Kimber has a sparkling plant in NJ and does all their own
 
#10 ·
My best guess on a new Colt DA revolver is that it'll be something very close to the Magnum Carry.
The market for CCW revolvers is booming, and a small frame Colt would be a good seller if they can keep the price within reason.

The Magnum Carry was basically a miniature King Cobra, and the design used mostly sintered steel or MIM internal parts.

The Colt history of bad decisions is really a history of what happens to a good company under the management of a disinterested, even hostile corporation.
Colt Firearms started this huge corporation and wound up as a tiny little piece that the corporation found embarrassing.

Every year or so they got a new company president sent down from corporate, and many of them knew nothing about guns and some were suspected of being actually somewhat anti-gun.
All they wanted to do is make a splash to impress the upper management so they could get the big promotion back to corporate and shake the grubby gun industry off the soles of their shoes.

Each new president ordered models discontinued, new models introduced, and the discontinued models re-introduced in a bewildering mess that left distributors, dealers, and buyers not knowing what was going to be available or not.
Then they spent stupid amounts of money on projects that anyone with sense knew was going to be a non-starter.
Just before the sale they were spending large amounts of money on an over and under shotgun they were going to import from Italy.
This with the company in trouble, the O&U market saturated and controlled by Browning and others, and which would have had very limited sales.

The current management is concentrating on models that will sell in quantity, and are carefully NOT making dumb business decisions.
It's rather disheartening to see Colt coming on strong, but still hearing people talk about Colt as though it's 1985 and some corporate Master of Business from the Warton School of Business is still fumbling the company around.
 
#12 · (Edited)
To ALL,

As for me, I wish that Colt would make .38SPL Diamondbacks again, so that I can buy a pair, to replace the ones that were stolen.
The "old school" DS & the Cobras would sell well, too, imVho.
(The last NICE 2 Cobras that I saw at the BIG SA show sold in the 1st 15 minutes of Saturday morning, for 600.oo each & NOT a bit of bargaining, either.)

yours, sw
 
#13 ·
The Diamondback today could be a real winner. The frame is just a real nice size for a lot of hands. A "carry melt" Diamondback could be interesting.

A while back I thought a "Diamondback Discreet" carry version could be a neat pistol. Maybe have a 3 1/2 in. barrel, carry melt the edges and corners of the frame a bit, etc.

The other versions, too.
 
#16 ·
I Thought...


...that we were speculating on what revolvers Colt could produce cost-effectively enough to make the effort financially attractive.

Perhaps someone such as Charlie can offer a realistic estimate of what a newly produced Python would have to sell for today.

My guess would be over two grand, with a rather limited market. Just my personal opinion but, if Colt were looking to re-enter the market for self-defense revolvers, the I-frame Python is rather large for that role.

I can't recall if I ever had the chance to dry-fire one of the SF-frame (same size as the D frame but with a coil-spring action) revolvers but I have made an observation about the V-spring, D-frame guns: Older women with poor hand strength sometimes find that the better leverage at the start of trigger stroke makes them easier to fire than a S&W revolver. If the coil-spring actions retain the better leverage (which I understand that S&W sacrificed when the went to the short-action triggers), that would be a potential market.
 
#18 ·
My guess would be over two grand, with a rather limited market. Just my personal opinion but, if Colt were looking to re-enter the market for self-defense revolvers, the I-frame Python is rather large for that role.

I knew it wasn't practical but I can dream can't I?
 
#19 ·
Personally, I'd think if Colt were REALLY serious about being in the market and competitive, they'd open shop in a Right-to-Work state and ditch those bloodsucking UAW parasites... who, oh by the way, their leaders have started trying to act as Obuttmunch's propagandists re the "Nobody wants to take YOUR gun" line of bullcrap.

Could keep some "premium price" for brand-name, charge less and STILL be more profitable....
 
#21 ·
As a recent purchaser of a brand new Colt’s 1911 (first new Colt’s in nearly 20 years), I have some observations on the .38 Super Model “O”

Likes
Fit and finish is superior to pretty much anyone out there making 1911’s. All the lines are straight, the cocking serrations are perfect. That’s a frequent mis-step for many other makers; my S&W is horrible in the cocking serrations. Most of the machine processes seem pretty much flawless on the Colt’s; really hard to find a machine mark anywhere. Bluing is much better than anything I’ve seen out of the competition. The visual aesthetics of the Colt’s leave their competition behind. Price was pretty competitive for what I consider a mid-level priced 1911 at just over $900. Mine has been completely reliable and remarkably accurate…Probably the most accurate semi-auto centerfire I own currently.

Dislikes:
Overall configuration…
It’s essentially a Series 80 pistol which was a good fit for the 1980’s but not so much today. I bought it because it “looks” like a classic 1911…but then again, it really doesn’t. I’m not exactly sure it does. Is it a 1911 or a 1911A1? It has the relief cuts behind the trigger, but then a long trigger and flat mainspring housing; identity crisis. Then there’s the other features that really ruin the “classic” part of the package. Lowered ejection port, high profile 3 dot sights (oh how I loathe them), and a beveled magazine well (Colt’s has always had the most piss poor mag well beveling I’ve ever seen). The still present synthetic trigger and MSH should go away. Don’t get me wrong, they PERFECTLY match the finish on my blued gun (that’s rather impressive) and it’s a slick way to get a lightweight trigger on a “classic” gun. But both should really be steel. “Buy the Series 70 gun” you say…Sure, but .38 Super isn’t an option in that line, and the Series 70’s still have the lowered ejection port. Oh, trigger pull sucked by the way; about 7lbs…That’s the only change I’ve made.

My point being: If you’re going to make a “classic” 1911 or 1911A1, then make a classic. If they were still making them, I would have gladly bought the “WW I 1911” they made; those were really cool. If they would make a Pre-Series 70 type 1911A1 in .38 Super, I’d take one in a heartbeat. Maybe it’s just me, maybe the market is responding to what they’re offering.

Honestly, I really don’t understand the relevance of a Series 80 type 1911 in today’s market. They should have two lines of 1911’s. Classic & Modern. If the Series 70 pistols are still good sellers (I can’t really imagine why) then you could group them under Classic.


Regardging their current “modern” 1911’s. What little I’ve seen/handled/shot; I have been left with a very positive impression. I shot a LW Commander in .38 Super that induced me to make an offer on the spot.
 
#36 ·
Dislikes:
My point being: If you're going to make a "classic" 1911 or 1911A1, then make a classic.
If you found a 7lb trigger, then Colt is continuing their "classic" traditions.:D

Kidding aside, Charlie's right back on the first page of this thread. Colt Patent Firearms Manufacturing should have been a HBS/WSB case study since WWII in how not to run a company.

Absolute arrogance about the concept that people would buy "Colt" regardless of quality/features can also be included.

A dignified burial would seem most appropriate at this time. The current Washington regime is unlikely to be as supporative of corporate life support in the firarms industry as past one.
 
#24 ·
From Grant Cunningham's...

...recent SHOT Show report:
...Korth revolvers start around $4k, which sounds like a lot - and it is. Let's put that into perspective, however: when I discussed the possibility of reviving the Python with the head of Colt's Custom Shop, he indicated that to reproduce it to the quality of the "classic" Python would mean a price tag of five large. (For those of you under 40, that's five grand or "five kay" - $5,000.) That level of hand fitting costs, no matter where it's made, which puts the Korth in the same ballpark a modern Python would have to be. The Korth people believe that there is a market for a high end revolver in this country, and I agree with them; the only question is whether people will understand that ANY revolver of such a grade is going to cost that much. I'm sure some will complain that a Performance Center gun is 1/4 of that cost while ignoring the fact that they're hardly in the same fit-and-finish ballpark...
Source
 
#26 ·
This just in...Colt's is now making a DAO 1991 series pistol: Colt 1991 Double Action Only - YouTube

Aluminum frame, DA action looks much like the Para Ordnance but the Colt's has a second strike capability whereas the PO LDA doesn't. I gotta admit, I'm really rather baffled when I look at this gun; I can't quite figure the market.

There's no way it's intended for Law Enforcement. If it were, it would wear synthetic grips, much more appropriate sighs, interchangeable backstraps, and much better sights…it would probably be about an inch shorter in the barrel also. So I don't see it as an LE market gun.

For civilian sales, it's an interesting alternative to what everyone else is producing, but exactly what is their "schtick in the market"…As in, what about it would make a guy say, "oh, I'd like to have that new Colt". It has a very nice looking finish, and the grips are nice.

To someone who's younger or new to guns, I don't see them being interested. It looks like a semi-retro sort of pistol to the untrained eye.

For us old farts, it's NOT a 1911, and we're all wondering just what the heck it really is.

They have that action available on the New Agent series, and for that, I can see some appeal (not necessarily for me, but for someone else). Maybe it's intended as a full size companion to the smaller pistol. In that case, I would think a Commander length version would be a bit more aesthetically appealing.

Now if they had built a gun like the .45 ACP Colt 1903 that Cylinder & Siide built a couple of years ago; I'd be rather interested in that. But this one, I just don't get.
 
#27 ·
Speaking of the Model M... one I really wish they'd re-introduce. I'm an "anti-Colt snob" on 1911's (I like mine as close to WWII GI-spec as I can get other than maybe a little sight upgrade and a smooth-front trigger: short trigger, relief cuts and arched MSH all help my stubby little fingers get a proper grip) but for a 1908 .380 made to be reliable with modern hollowpoints, I'd bite... though if they'd launch a "Colt's Classics" line with guns made to the cosmetics of yesteryear's, I'd even be open to the use of modern materials and techniques (bring on the CNC!) as long as they looked right.
 
#28 ·
Put a HP in the pipe, and follow it up with either FMJ's or Buffalo Bore's RNFP cast bullet design. The .380 with hollow points is rather penetration challenged to begin with. Personally, for .32 ACP and .380, I just go FMJ, and rely on the loose nut behind the trigger to put them where they count. I have a couple of old school .32's and .380's and I carry them on rare occasion. But when I do I understand I"m a bit "under-gunned" and may have to put several rounds through the engine room before I get someone's attention.
 
#29 · (Edited)
Bad news, from Hognose Man, via The Firearm Blog:

Colt?s Struggling To Stay Afloat, Bankruptcy Looms - The Firearm Blog

Worth a read. Hair pulling stuff if one is into financials. The term "hedge fund chutzpah" is brutal. I also forwarded the article to a certain former poster here, of The Gun Zone -- the authoritative resource for firearms information. , as I am sure he would find it of interest.

I guess we can always hope that Alan Mulally, Richard Branson or Mitt Romney has a real love for firearms, especially Colt ones, and will buy out the company if it tanks. Sad, as they have shown serious initiative lately on the product side. I still wonder how, with demand for guns through the roof, anyone could fail at making and selling decent quality pieces?

Mr. Mulally, who turned around Ford, after doing solid work at Boeing:

Alan Mulally - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I would love to see what he could do if he took on running Colt as a project.
 
#30 ·
Mulally was actually tossed out of Boeing for being the last Heritage Boeing executive there, and the last exec with any integrity--I know him by rep at a couple degrees of separation via contacts who worked under him, and while there ain't a lot of people who could say "come work for me" and get me to take down my freelancer's shingle he's one of 'em.
 
#31 ·
What are they thinking?

The pocket pistol market has good guns without bringing back something that died 50+ years ago.

I like the pocket model .32 and .380 guns because they make a nice collection and the old Colt pre-war blue is gorgeous.

My bet is they will be a new rarity.
 
#33 ·
To All,

Personally, I'd like Colt to bring back the 1908 pistol with an ambidextrous safety & that will safely feed/fire the newer "HOT" .380ACP JHP loads.
(I carried one of the little 1908 Colts for years, 24/7 & was quite fond of its lightness/flatness. Had it not been stolen from my quarters, I would likely still be carrying it in 2015.)

yours, sw
 
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