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Old 12-04-2006, 11:07 AM   #1
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Educate me - bull v bushing

I am looking at 1911s. Some have bull barrels, some have bushings. Advantages/disadvantages of each? Is accuracy better with one or the other?
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Old 12-04-2006, 05:33 PM   #2
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Unless you are talking about custom fitted guns there probably isn't any real difference. The bull barrels are slightly heavier which some think is an advantage in recoil. If so it is very small..

The downside of bull barrels is that they must have a full length guide rod and reverse recoil spring plug. I don't like guide rods for several reasons, but they complicate field stripping and usually require a paper clip or some other tool to capture the spring so you can take it apart.
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Old 12-05-2006, 08:51 AM   #3
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Thanks. Being my first semi-auto, I think the easier to field strip the better. Considering the 3" group at 15 yards was the best I could muster at the range last weekend with a rented 1911, accuracy isn't going to be an issue for a while.

Again, thanks.
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Old 12-05-2006, 09:04 AM   #4
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That's not bad... start with a full size too
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Old 12-05-2006, 09:27 AM   #5
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Exactly what I am looking at. Full sized in .45ACP. I think three dot sights would have helped a bit since the black sights on a black target was somewhat difficult. I haven't shot in 7 or 8 years (since I moved to CA) and thought it was time I at least rented something to get practice.
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Old 12-05-2006, 12:04 PM   #6
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I also thought that the .22 conversion would be a good way to get plenty of rounds through and have the gun feel mostly the same, except for recoil of course.

Though the ammo at the range wasn't bad at $13 for a box of 50 and $4.00 discount on the range.

Now all I need is $$$.
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Old 12-05-2006, 12:51 PM   #7
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I too prefer the bushing. You can set it up as tight or as loose as you want. You can replace it fairly cheaply if/when it wears to sloppy. You can even fit TWO bushings if you like, a real tight one for "target" and practice, and a looser, finger-removable one for field or duty use.

Also, I don't like the big hole at the end of the gun that most bushing-less systems seem to leave. I'm always afraid some lint or dirt or ick of some sort will find its way in there and gum up the works. Probably an unfounded worry, as I've never actually heard of a problem of this kind, but a wise man told me long ago, "99 percent of the stuff you worry about never happens. It's the stuff you never think of at all that bites you on the butt."

Also, your idea of obtaining a .22 conversion is a good one. For even Walmart's reasonable price for 100 rounds of generic .45 (about $22, last time I bought some), you can buy 1100 rounds of .22. Prices are going up, but the ratio is likely to remain the same. I like the Ciener unit. There are those who will try to tell you how great the Marvel unit is, which is true--it is more accurate than the Ciener, but costs two and a half times as much. It will be years before you develop the skill to tell the difference between them. I've been shooting handguns for over 30 years and to this day I'd need a benchrest and probably a scope to wring out all the accuracy the Marvel can deliver.
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Old 12-05-2006, 01:06 PM   #8
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I started about 20 some odd years ago, but that 8 year hiatus really set me back. I figure much practice will help. I had started a while ago with a Crosman pellet revolver with a pellet trap in our storage shed, but the CO2 seal went bad so off to the range I went. I did get one bull at 25 yards, but I think it was a fluke.

I think the 1911 is capable of better groups than I can put out at the moment. I intend to rectify that.

The .22 conversion takes what, a couple minutes?
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Old 12-05-2006, 01:17 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flipper35
The .22 conversion takes what, a couple minutes?
How long does it take you to take the slide off and put it back on? The Ciener unit actually goes on easier than the .45 top half, as it's completely contained and you don't have to mess with the link or the bushing.
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Old 12-05-2006, 01:42 PM   #10
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My last step then is getting some spare cash to buy one instead of renting. Though the rental was a nice one, it isn't the same as your own.

I appreciate the info guys. Is this a great place or what?
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Old 12-05-2006, 04:59 PM   #11
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Permit me to ask, Snake, if you have ever actually seen a 1911 that was unreliable from the bushing being too tight.
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Old 12-05-2006, 06:24 PM   #12
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Personally, no. Charlie might have another answer to that question, as might anyone else. I was thinking more in terms of strippability without tools. If I were heading far from base with a 1911, the ability to strip it without a wrench (as most of my 1911s are set up) would be more important to me than the last possible half-inch (or even full inch) of accuracy at 25 yards.

I like to set my guns up to where I can JUST strip them with my fingers, but there is no felt play anywhere in the barrel/bushing/slide connection.
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Old 12-05-2006, 06:54 PM   #13
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yes Chub and if it's really bad accuracy goes down too

but it isn't the fit to the slide it is with the barrel. I like to need a wrench to turn it, but it does not need to be too snug
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Old 12-16-2006, 09:31 AM   #14
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I've never seen it myself however, I have seen 1911s in my shop that wouldn't operate after the customer decided to fit a new bushing. They always forget to bevel the backside so the barrel will tilt, stops them every time.
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Old 09-15-2016, 01:05 PM   #15
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Long time eh?

I know this was many years ago and with moving back to Wisconsin I lost track of the history of these forums. I did get my 1911 and .22 conversion.It shoots very well and has been dead reliable, though you have to run high velocity .22 to cycle properly yet as that slide isn't broken in.

For father's day we all went to an outdoor range and dad jokingly asked if I could hit a bottle cap at 100 yards sitting on the berm. I never hit it but was close enough to move it around a lot. It shoots well.

No, that isn't the real S/N.
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Old 11-15-2016, 01:26 PM   #16
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OK, another update. With the .45 barrel and slide is it still dead reliable and my groups are much, much better.

With the .22 though it has gotten worse. After about 350 rounds it would fail to eject properly and that would be my fault as I probably didn't clean it thoroughly enough. I have since scrubbed and cleaned and soaked and scrubbed again and now it ejects great, but will fail to feed properly the last two rounds. Part of me thinks that since it ran flawlessly after the first 100 rounds with a clean and lube every 100 rounds it should run flawless again. Another part of me thinks it has a few hundred more to go to be properly broken in. The slide slows when it rubs the hammer on the way back to battery. I am using Hoppes when I clean and lube. The pistol came with FP-10 and I don't know the factory lube on the conversion kit. I suspect the same. I know it had been cleaned and lubed a few times before it was acting up but I didn't get the feed ramp clean enough then. It is a very accurate plinker though. Have no issues hitting those little 2" spinning targets at 25 yards.

I suppose a good scrubbing of the feed ramp again and I might pick up some FP-10 for it unless you all think the lube isn't this issue. One positive thing, it helps with clearing exercises.
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Old 11-16-2016, 02:06 AM   #17
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.22 Conversions are notoriously ammo sensitive. Did you try different brands or was it the same ammo?
Geoff
Who has one mounted on a spare frame, it only likes CCI plated ammo.
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Old 11-16-2016, 06:32 AM   #18
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It was working very well with CCI MiniMags and some high velocity ammo dad had from years ago in a round can that was .99c. Now it acts up with any ammo the last two rounds. When I first got it the first two rounds were the problem. I think my biggest issue is not having the patience. The weather is far cooler than when we were out shooting as well and that can have an effect. I just want to make sure the Hoppes isnt't the issue.

I just need to go out with the kids. They will run a couple hundred rounds through it for me!
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